Episode 141: When I'm 85 - an interview with Madeleine Kunin

It doesn’t end at 80 or 85. As long as you’re still curious, as long as you’re still interested in new things, you can be happy.
— Madeleine Kunin

A few years ago I spoke to former Vermont governor Madeleine Kunin for a show called Politics is Power. When I took some of her career advice and wrote it up in a LinkedIn post, it got hundreds of (positive) comments. So when I heard she had a new memoir out about being in her eighties, I couldn't wait to speak to her again.

In this show we discuss what it's like to officially be an old woman, and talk about some of the highs and lows of reaching your eighties. We discuss how Madeleine has changed as a person and go back in time to her childhood, to parts of her career, and to the time she became a single professional woman at 60, after many years as a wife. She found love again at 71.

Being 85, she says, 'is not what I pictured in my mind.' It’s better.

You can also read a transcript of the show.

Further reading: You can read more about Madeleine’s marriage to John Hennessey in this New York Times piece.

Here’s an obituary of John from the Burlington Free Press and an appreciation by staff at Dartmouth College, where he spent much of his career.

Madeleine’s previous two books are Pearls, Politics & Power and The New Feminist Agenda.

Episode 140: The Coaching Cure, part 2: The Coachee

Even if somebody has all the certifications they still might not be very good - or they might be great. They might not have any certifications and they might be brilliant.
— Anne Libby
There are many men in particular who would not be caught dead reading a self-help book, but they would be happy to tell you that they’re meeting with their coach.
— Christine Whelan
Christine Whelan

Christine Whelan

This coaching has made me much more aware of my feelings and helped me stop just pushing aside my emotions, which I think many women are told to do at the office.
— Danielle Sauvé

This is the second of two shows on women and the coaching industry (listen to the first one here). This time we find out about one novice coachee's first experience of leadership coaching at work. We talk to management expert Anne Libby and coach trainer Terry Maltbia about why coaching has become so popular during the last several years, especially among women - and why anyone picking a coach should ask plenty of questions first. And we meet Christine Whelan, a professor of consumer science and an expert on the self-help industry.

You can also read a transcript of the show.

Further reading:

If you’re considering any area of self-help where you might spend a chunk of change, check out SeekSafely.org first.

Also, here are the International Coach Federation’s tips for choosing a coach.

Some stuff that didn’t make it into the show because I couldn’t neatly weave it into the narrative: If you live in the west and pay attention to these things, you may have noticed most coaches are white. Terry Maltbia at Columbia University (a coach trainer and an African-American man) told me that in his experience, the biggest group of coaches is made up of white women, next come white men, and then women of color (this is in the US). He thinks this is probably related to how coaching grew up in the first place, as part of what he called ‘the human potential movement’ - and it was people with some money behind them - usually white people - who could afford to a) think about human potential and b) take a chance on being a coach and/or pay for some training. He said it’s not much spoken of in the coaching industry, but the racial disparity is something he notices whenever he’s at industry events. He mentioned that on his training program at Columbia University Teachers College, most women of color who attend are coming from Latin America, and particularly from Brazil.

The other thing I wanted to get into is what can be the scammy underbelly of the coaching industry. As I said last time, coaching is unregulated and anyone can hang out a shingle as a coach. Lots of people are doing so. Many new coaches find it challenging to make a living at first. You don’t have to spend long online to see that endless numbers of people market themselves as coach marketers - in fact one of them hit me up on LinkedIn recently. They claim to be able to vastly increase a coach’s business. This kind of thing makes me incredibly wary (others I’ve spoken to have compared the coaching industry to a multi-level marketing scheme, noting some coaches’ websites are suspiciously similar). I’m already wary of the happy talk and ra-ra attitude that can be such a big part of the self-improvement industry. We should all maintain some cynicism as we search for and interview coaches.

Your thoughts are always welcome.

Episode 139: The Coaching Cure, part 1: The Coach

Coaches have always existed in some form...if you want to be better at being yourself and doing your life, it costs something.
— Kate Schutt
My clients don’t have a lot of support in their lives for themselves...the mentors they might go to are so busy themselves.
— Rachel Garrett
Kate schutt

Kate schutt

A few years ago I wrote a post called Everyone’s a Coach. Because that’s how it felt to me. Ever since I’d started the show I’d noticed an increasing number of social media profiles of women using the title ‘coach.’ And they all seemed to be targeting their services at other women.

Rachel Garrett

Rachel Garrett

The coaching industry is growing fast all over the world. It’s unregulated, and anyone can call themselves a coach. The majority of coaches are women, as are the majority of clients. So why do more women than men seek coaching, and why are so many women drawn to the profession?

This is the first of two shows that looks at women’s relationship with the coaching industry. In this episode we meet two coaches, Kate Schutt and Rachel Garrett, and we hear from Terry Maltbia, a trainer of coaches.

You can also read a transcript of the show.

I’d love to hear from people about this episode. Does it resonate with your experience, or not? What do you wish you’d heard that you didn’t? I’m releasing a second episode in two weeks.

Further reading: The International Coach Federation has the most recent global survey on coaching.

Terry Maltbia directs the Columbia Coaching Certification Program.

The Harvard Business Review published The Wild West of Executive Coaching in 2004, but it’s still relevant today.

Episode 138: Focus Amidst the Chaos

Women don’t think they have the right to spend time on their book or their painting or whatever it is until they’ve checked all the boxes and everyone is OK. And the fact is no one is ever gonna be OK.
— Jessica Abel

Right now a lot of us are thinking about our intentions for the new year. Plenty of people have a side project they're hoping to get off the ground - it could be a novel, a new business, or perhaps you just want to learn to paint. Whatever it is, you have to make it happen on top of the rest of your life. Which is where the problems start.

In this episode cartoonist, teacher, and author Jessica Abel talks about how to bring focus to a crowded life so you can actually turn your idea into a reality.

You can also read a transcript of the show.

At the top of the episode you heard me talk about Anne Libby’s newsletter On Management. Anne has been a guest on the show and is also a supporter. You can sign up for her newsletter right here.

Jessica abel

Jessica abel

Further reading: Jessica’s latest book is Growing Gills: How to Find Creative Focus When You’re Drowning in Your Daily Life.

Here are a few of her blog posts as well: the first is on ‘idea debt’, which she mentioned in the show. The second is on scarcity and why so many creatives work like crazy, moving from project to project without allowing any time to think or strategize in between (and how to change that). The third is on how to escape panic mode and actually get on with your creative project.

Episode 137: Pregnancy Loss and Work

Just for practical reasons you have to keep it secret, but then you also can’t be grieving or emotionally affected outwardly in any way.
— Jorli Peña
Photo by Marjan_Apostolovic/iStock / Getty Images

Photo by Marjan_Apostolovic/iStock / Getty Images

I remember Googling what to say when you experience a miscarriage at work...I found absolutely no advice anywhere on what to [tell] people you manage.
— Ceri Angood Napier

Around a fifth of pregnancies end in miscarriage, but we rarely talk about it. As my guest April Boyd says:

When you’re talking about infant loss and pregnancy loss, those are incredibly taboo topics in our culture.

In this episode we take on that taboo. Most women work, and when we miscarry we’re often recovering physically and psychologically in the workplace. Often, our colleagues will have no idea we were ever pregnant. But they may wonder why we seem upset or distracted.

In this show you’ll meet three women from three different countries, each with a different experience of pregnancy loss and work. Jorli Peña was working for a US corporate giant when she had her first miscarriage. It was not to be her last. Ceri Angood Napier had spent years trying to get pregnant when she finally got good news, quickly followed by bad. She then had to work out what, if anything, to tell her team about why she’d been off for two weeks. April Boyd suffered the loss of her daughter Nora soon after her birth in 2013. She runs the Love & Loss Project, helping people who have suffered infant or pregnancy loss cope with the world they come back to afterwards.

I’d love to hear from you - please post a comment below.

You can also read a transcript of the show.

Episode 136: Loyalty Has Limits

It’s a very female perspective on a job. I didn’t want to let anyone down...I don’t know if a man would ever be, ‘I can’t leave this job, it would break my heart.’
— Danielle Maveal
I’m constantly thinking about the whole presentation, body language, what my facial expression must look like, the tone of my voice, the volume of my voice.
— Kim Norris

So many women stick around in jobs they've had for years, unsure of their next step. In the first part of this episode we look at why it can be so hard to move on even when we know we should. We talk to Danielle Maveal, who found it incredibly tough to walk away from her job at Etsy, and to Terri Boyer, who now directs the Institute for Women’s Leadership at Villanova University.

In part two we talk about emotions in the workplace. Is it OK to cry openly (really?) or should we stick with the conventional advice to flee to the bathroom? We learn from author Anne Kreamer about gender and the science of tears. And we meet Kim Norris, who has to watch her tone of voice and expression pretty much all the time for fear of being misunderstood.

You can also read a transcript of the show.

Further reading: McKinsey and Company and Lean In recently came out with their 2018 report on Women in the Workplace.